Public Dislikes Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker's Union Busting

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Wow!!! Just the fact that you opened your mouth in agreement with B.S. ( Bob Schlessinger) puts you in the intelligence bracket of a bag of hammers. You obviously don't work for a union to make the argument against garbageman Nelson making 109,000 in O.T. Do you understand what call times are or meal tickets and that there is no limit as to how many you can stack in a day. It is a 6 hour penalty pay that one gets for coming in during off hours to work whether or not the work takes 6 hours or 5 minutes. On a holiday when people are off it is at double time with the min at time and a half. (Sundays are double time for me also) Holidays are double + 8 for me. It was not unusual for guys in our mill to make a six figure income at an hourly rate of 16-18 dollars an hour twelve years ago. My rate is now over 27.00 per hour. Here is the real kicker.... I don't have a college education.
To go further you make the argument for Carolyn Martin - Chancellor (CEO) of UW Madison that she should get equivalent pay to that of the private sector CEOs. You really shine here Dave! Even if you make the assumption that there are 6000 maintenance and grounds and support staff working in the system that leaves you with a 4-1 student teacher ratio and 53,000 a year tuition. You think this is good in light of the fact that there is more than just UW Madison in the state college system? Each one with their own little hierarchy? Not a very good ROI if you ask me. ROI is return on investment for the uninformed.
This is exactly what it appears to be...... putting the people who pay for the public sector workers (private sector taxpayers) back in charge. It is interesting that a terrorist hides behind women and children when they defend themselves and their behavior.

Jeff of WI 7:04AM February 25, 2011

Do some logical reasoning and math, PLEASE! Garbageman Nelson made $159,258 w/$109,892 of that in OT. 159258-109892=49366 49366 / 2080 (work hour in a year) = $23.73/hr straight time pay, OT pay = $35.60/hr. 109892 / 35.60 = 3086 hours worked over 2080 straight time. 2080 + 3086 = 5166 total hours worked. 5166 / 52 weeks in a year = 99 hours a week AVERAGE. 99 hours/wk / 5 days (no garbage collection on weekends) = 19.8 hour week days days, no vacations or holidays. Obviously he got back pay or something from a lawsuit.
Carolyn Martin - Chancellor (CEO) of UW Madison - PhD in charge of 16,000 employees, more than 42,000 students, $2.2 Billion operating budget. Name me a private sector CEO that makes less than $1 million with comparable employees & budget?
I could write 2 more pages of disputing facts, but the fact is, Walker is trying to remove union rights, not reduce pay. i have serious doubts any facts disputing or justifying these numbers will not be believed here and I expect many more uninformed comments to this.
Please don't pick & choose facts, they'll mislead you every time.

dave of WI 12:21AM February 25, 2011

Study after study (done independently) in my state shows that state employee salaries/benefits lag slightly behind their private sector counterparts. The latest showed a small gap of 3%. The problem as I see it (and yes, I'm a retired state employee) is the perception that state employees make more because their benefits are typically higher. So, I agree that employee unions need to recognize that and be willing to trade benefits for salary.
Meanwhile the states have huge budget deficits, partly caused by piling on program after program when revenues were healthy. But no one wants to talk about cutting programs. In my 30+ years in state service I saw our core business move further and further away from the original purpose (licensing drivers and registering vehicles). I had some ability to comment on new/proposed legislation and tried again and again to get Legislators to give bills a sunset provision and a study requirement to show they did what intended. I was rarely successful. Doesn't it make sense to remove driving privilegs of kids who drop out of school, or fathers who don't pay child support? Well, maybe. But noboby was every able to prove it to me, and they didn't try.
Do we need to take money out of the school budgets for free breakfast? Yes, I understand that kids learn better when their tummies are full, but I'm not sure that taking $'s out of the classroom is the best way to deal with the problem.
So, here I sit with my fat retirement benefit and pay $900 per month for health insurance. Meanwhile the CEO of that health insurance company makes $25 million per year in salary and benefits. Maybe we should ask him to contribute something to the state coffers.

Becky of OR 10:32PM February 24, 2011

I'd have a lot more respect for these governors if they'd be honest and simply say they want to disolve the unions. But Scott Walker keeps saying he doesn't have any options. Obviously not a man of vision. There are always options.
Most states have budget issues. But unlike Wisconsin, Ohio, and a few more, other governors are working through the issues, and finding options and solutions all parties can agree on. They, too, are tackling the tough issues, but doing it in a way that earns the respect of their constituents.
There's no excuse for not treating your "employees," with dignity and respect. And you don't have to "drop the bomb on them" as Walker revealed in his prank phone conversation with David Koch.
Anyone who doesn't remember their history lessons about the conditions that caused labor to organize, and the resultant development of a strong middle class in America needs to make a quick trip to the library. "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

Becky of OR 9:50PM February 24, 2011

Scott of NV, this is not just a Wisconsin issue, because Scott Walker has openly enlisted governors in other states to help in the GOP campaign to destroy the unions.

Jack of CA 6:14PM February 24, 2011

The opinion of those in New York or California and all the states in-between do not count. This is a Wisconsin issue and should be decided by the elected officials of Wisconsin.

Scott of NV 3:59PM February 24, 2011

I can tell you as a centrist in NJ who was fed up with ever-rising property tax rates, the seeming inability of NJ State government to cut their budget by renegotiating state worker benefits, and the intransigence of the state teacher's union, I was more than glad to see Christie take a firm stance on BEHALF of the regular taxpayer. His ability to get results has made him the most popular governor -- except amongst the hardcore union teachers -- in NJ in easily 20 years. I don't know where these "negative" polls are being conducted, but right now Christie would be elected by 50-60 points in NJ. maybe some folks should get out from behind the phone and speak to the average Joe in the supermarket or softball field.

George of NJ 3:40PM February 24, 2011

I guess some responders have missed the basic obligations of Catholic Social teaching as endorsed by the United States Council of Bishops: "The Dignity of Work and the Rights of Workers. The economy must serve people, not the other way around. Work is more than a way to make a living; it is a form of continuing participation in God’s creation. If the dignity of work is to be protected, then the basic rights of workers must be respected--the right to productive work, to decent and fair wages, to the organization and joining of unions, to private property, and to economic initiative."
Or do these values only apply when trying to help people in third world countries fighting oppressive regimes and oligarchies/monopolies?
Where are the Family Values supporters now for the "Call to Family, Community, and Participation where The person is not only sacred but also social. How we organize our society—in economics and politics, in law and policy—directly affects human dignity and the capacity of individuals to grow in community. Marriage and the family are the central social institutions that must be supported and strengthened, not undermined. We believe people have a right and a duty to participate in society, seeking together the common good and well-being of all, especially the poor and vulnerable."

joe of OH 3:33PM February 24, 2011

This issue isn't about state budgets but about society's predators -- the Koches and Scaifes and their ilk, and their GOP stooges -- and their abiding dream of returning working people to peonage by destroying their only effective means of protecting themselves, the unions.
Erin of WI is exactly right: "Stop being brainwashed by rich, greedy, pathological people!!!!"
Problem is, I'm not sure there is much brain to be washed. There are only glands, primitive limbic-level glands, that react -- and only from greed and fear. This is the right-wing base, made up largely of red necks, who don't know any better, and of geezers, who should know better, but who have no future and begrudge those who do and are outraged at the thought that their precious money is going to people they don't know or care about or the infrastructure they don't want to maintain because THEY don't use it.
Democrats are often wrongheaded on many issues and certainly pusillanimous for allowing the spiders and snakes of the right to take control of the public discourse via talk radio and the blogs. And in that regard, can there be any better testimony to Democratic fecklessness their allowing the appointment to the Supreme Court of GOP stooges to decree that money is speech?
But while the Dems and liberals are infuriatingly obtuse and fatuous, the right wing, including the union-bashing posters here, are just plain evil. And I'm not just name-calling -- they really are! For them, it's all about money and themselves, about the fear that they actually have to contribute to society at-large. In fact, anything to the common good they dismiss as -- guess what -- Socialism!
I think that at heart, all conservatives are atheists, because if they, like Jefferson, believed in a just God, then they would be trembling in terror. Liberals may be fools, who have only good intentions on their side, but come Judgment Day, they will have far less explaining to do than conservatives, whose meanness was marshaled to great effect last November and is on copious display here.
The only silver lining in this dismal picture is that the geezers who make up the the right wing's base and who, alas, vote, will soon pass.

Jack of CA 2:23PM February 24, 2011

The Teachers' Union doesn't have the Right to negotiate collectively. Instead, it was granted permission to do so by the elected representatives of the People of Wisconsin. The People have now elected new representatives who want to modify what the Union has permission to do. The Democrat aparachiks in the Wisconsin Senate are now helping the Union nomeklatura class in trying to protect its priviledge at the expense of the People

Tiki Hat of FL 1:39PM February 24, 2011