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In Obama-Catholic Church Relations, the Rift Is Between the Church and Its American Followers

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First-there are no Vatican destined funds coming from the dioceses and archdioceses of the USA EXCEPT for Peter's Pence, when a collection is made throughout the USA to send to the Holy Father for him to then disteibute these funds to his favorite charities. FINIS! END! NO monioes are routinely sent to Rome! Second-just because a bishop is assigned to Rome, does nbot mean he loses his citizenaship and rights of free speech to criticize OR applaud a sitting Chief Executive! FACT: The HOLY fATHER gave President Obama a book when the US President visited Rome recently! Book TITLE: Bioethics! A gentle slam at President Obama for his stand approving abortion. FACT: American taxpayers subsidize Planned parenthood, to the tune of 375,000,000.00 per year! Benedict XVI is Not an American, but as a religious leader he has a responsibiloity AND a right to speak UP for human life, as does Bishop Burke! Oh, by the way-Peter's Pence, usually results in about 35,000,000.00 sent to Rome! NOT 357,000,000.00 as is the case for the INVOLUTARILY given monies by USA taxpayers, like it or not, to Planned Parenthood! AND, Infalibility was a UNIVERSALLY declared principle of all the Catholic bishops at Vatican 1 Council, NOT Vatican II! AND, that is ONLY in matters of faith and morals and WHEN the Holy Father speaks as hread of the Church and declares this as such! iT HAS ONLY BEEN USED TWO-THREE TIMES! not routinely! PLEASE educate yourselves before condemning beliefs you have only heard from some bible thumping hate filled preacher or "teacher"THIS REMINDS ME OF CRITICISM THAT THE CHURCH REFUSED TO ALLOW CATHOLICS TO READ THE BIBLE BECAUSE THEY CHAINED THEM UP! YUP! Juast like the phone company chained up the phone directories in pay phone booths so the people would not walk off with them! DUH!!!!!! Ring any bells yet folks? Costumes? They are called vestments! Please TRY to sound
educated before you hang yourselves with your yoke of illiteracy and ignorance!
LAL

LA Lynch of CO 12:13AM August 28, 2009

Obama's "Catholic Plan" is the title of a recent TV episode from RealCatholicTV.com. The video is part of a daily commentary on politics, religion and the Church. RealCatholicTV is a new Internet television network which focuses on authentic Catholic programming. Daily news segments cover Catholicism and Politics. The "Obama Catholic Plan" video has been seen by 183,000 viewers.
http://www.governmenttv.us/pb/wp_71194748/wp_71194748.html

Stan Roberts of NY 11:08PM July 20, 2009

Those church officials who hatefully preach the legalisms of an 'infallible' church as opposed to the teachings of Christ (i.e., the individuals with effective control of the church) insist that God will cast you into hell if you don't obey them. In essence, they function as the devil's disciples on earth by their diligent efforts to usurp the word of Christ for their own glorification and benefit.
The officialdom of the church has, for the last 30 years, made every effort to purge the church of about three-fourths of its members because those members have demonstrated insufficient obedience to the corrupt church hierarchy. In fact, that hierarchy has now reached a point of condemning those church leaders who don't follow the most radical, divisive and decidedly unholy brand of orthodoxy. This ongoing purge has now reached critical mass and will likely result in the complete destruction of a church which already finds itself eliminating parishes because of disappearing parishioners, disappearing revenues, and disappearing recruits to the priesthood. The rulers of the church have become the very people Jesus spoke against.
You can follow some so-called Christian sect or other straight to its hell, or you can listen to Jesus...and Jesus alone, not the corrupt, self-aggrandizing, arrogant 'holy men' in costumes, not the usurpers who appeared after Jesus, particularly the one known as 'Paul the Apostle' - who was obviously not an apostle at all since he never met, saw or heard Jesus, even though the Roman Catholic church and most of the rest of so-called Christianity effectively trumpets his pronouncements above those of Jesus - and not the Torah either (except for the historical context, much of which was clearly opposed by Jesus).
As a side note, not only do these self-aggrandizing loudmouths care nothing for ACTUAL life as opposed to POTENTIAL life (war and its attendant murder and mass murder is good and might even be holy, but preventing conception is a mortal sin), but the birth control and abortion issues were simply not issues at all until the papacy began to be alarmed by a reduction in the birth rate of France in the 19th century. That alarm arose from a rapid reduction in the money being sent from the churches in France to the papacy...and France was its greatest source of money at the time. Suddenly, birth control and abortion were mortal sins and/or excommunicable offenses and the pope became 'infallible' (that last one an incredibly amusing concept which the various VERY fallible popes had not dared to assert for the first 1800 years of the church's existence). Until the 'crisis in France', the church followed the teaching of Thomas Aquinas regarding human life - that it began at the quickening, which occurs from about 18 to 22 weeks into pregnancy. Once the pope became 'infallible', though, Thomas Aquinas and all of the other theologians, saints, apostles, and even Jesus himself became irrelevant.

Martel of MO 1:19PM May 09, 2009

The Pope is complimentary of President Obama. Cardinal George, President of the National Bishops has complimentary remarks about good things President Obama is doing to reduce abortions.Many American bishops speak well of President Obama.And without being asked and without any case involving President Obama in Archbishop's "Supreme Court in the Vatican", Burke trashes the President of the United States every few weeks. The ad homenem attacks by Burke are right out of the play book of the Right Wing fanatics of the Republican Party. I think that Burke should shut up out of respect to his office he holds in the Vatican's Court, and he should quit trashing the President of the United States while he is an official on foreign soil. It is a shame Archbishop Burke has no more respect for the opinions of the Holy Father and the President of the Conference of American Bishops expressed favorably about our president. Do they agree with every position of President Obama? Certainly not, just as there is hardly everyone who shares Archbishop's views of our President or his behavior towards the leader of our nation.It is time the Pope withdrzw Archbishop Burke from the political arena and let him clear the dockets of his court which are years and years behind.Justice delayed is Justice denied. Burke needs to take care of his own business duly assigned to him by the Holy Father in Rome instead of engaging in partisan politics in the U.S. from afar.

jacob of LA 12:22PM May 09, 2009

Obama is the President of the United States of America and it is an honor that he agreed to speak at the Notre Dame commencement. The scholars at Notre Dame are correct in not submitting to intimidation to rescind that invitation. What is more disturbing is that Archbishop Raymond Burke has been appointed to the Vatican Supreme Court. It is a continuing sign of Pope Benedict's disconnect with Catholics of all stripes around the world. He is another dictator, scholar with no real pastoral experience, demanding that the sheep follow and obey. He is taking the Church backwards, undermining Vatican II. First he allows the expanded return of the Latin Rite of mass, he welcomes back an extremist Halocaust denyer to "heal" and please the extreme right wing of the church. He insults the Jews by returning an offensive "pleading" to the Good Friday service, and he insults Muslims. It's not Catholics moving away from the Church, it is the Church hierarchy failing to fulfill Christ's mission to deliver the message and persuade the hearts of mankind.

CarmanK of MD 9:12AM May 09, 2009

I am all for removing any religions tax exemption status when they try to force their ideologies into government. Notre Dame invited President Obama....hence any objections need to addressed to Notre Dame and not the president.

Mary of NM 4:30PM May 08, 2009

For someone who is not Catholic and hence not bound by the Churches teachings there is no controversy. Had it been Joe Biden or John Carey the situation would be different. If Obama was attending to address his stance on abortion then I'm sure that Notre-Dame would be turning him down.
To suggest that there is a rift between Catholics and the church is misleading. Most 'Catholics' that have issues are no longer practicing Catholics anyways. So do we include them in this arguement that there is a rift? As the Holy Father said, "It would be better to have fewer Catholics, than to have Catholics who follow heresy".
Someone who suggests that the Church may split into "The American Catholic Church" simply does not understand the Church.

Joseph of CA 1:36PM May 08, 2009

anyone who votes pro-choice has a moratl sin and if you die in the state of mortal sin you go to hell

Person for the Pope of OH 6:00PM April 30, 2009

The Bishops of the United States are according to Pope Clement to be elected by the people.
In addition the Pope servers at the will of the People and can removed under protocols set forth by the Council of Constance. US Catholics need to clean house at the Vatican.
Maybe the electioneering and political grandstanding will lead to worldwide reform in the RCC. Humane Vitae was opposed by both clerics and laity who helped Paul VI on the issue of contraception, and family planning. All the current problems faced in the USA by the church stem from this poorly considered policy. We meed to demand reform.

skyrider of FL 10:55PM April 26, 2009

"When it comes to the Obama administration's relations with the Roman Catholic Church, the real political rift isn't between the bishops and the president. It's between the church and its American flock."
Certainly there is a rift between the Church and many of Her American flock but not all.
The Notre Dame - Obama situation many very well be when the line is drawn in the sand. Those who support Notre Dame and Obama may have to decide whether or not they want to be associated with the Catholic Church or not.
I wouldn't be surprise if in the years to come we start seeing even yet another new Church born in America. Perhaps the name of this Church will be called The American Catholic Church. Perhaps Father Jenkins could be the first bishop.

Helen Hawkins of CO 8:11PM April 22, 2009