Home > Debate Club > Has Christmas Become Too Secular? > Militant Secularists Should Declare Christmas Truce

Militant Secularists Should Declare Christmas Truce

Crackdown on religious free speech can't be ignored

Reader Comments
Back to argument

The war on Christmas is a phony contrivance by Christian religious types to portray themselves as victims. It's too bad about the experience at the P.O. with the carolers. Unless they were being too loud, I don't see anything wrong or especially unlawful with what they did. What's with the grumpy postmaster? Hasn't anyone noticed how boring it is at the post office most of the time? Even if you are not religious, just listen to the message of the carolers - it's quite positive. The legal line between church and state is clearly defined by spending tax money on any one particular religion. Volunteer religious expression without any cost to taxpayers is freedom of speech and religion.

J. Richards of MO 3:36PM December 27, 2011

Wow - 95% of Americans are Christian? Really? Can you please cite your source because I have never seen any reliable source place the number that high. I usually see somewhere in the 75% - 80% range. I hope you have some excuse for this figure as someone who is a VP at "Research Council" should know how to do proper research. I will be checking back for your response. Here are a couple of articles (ones that actually cite sources) showing figures far below your 95%:

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=7041036&page=1#.TvU-P9QS0uc

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_United_States

http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/on-faith/poll-nearly-80-percent-of-americans-are-christian/2011/12/23/gIQA3yU3DP_story.html

Cassandra of IL 10:00PM December 23, 2011

Government can't push religion. No one *cares* if you have a giant nativity scene outside of your church, the government just can't do the same. This isn't a new concept. You wouldn't want a giant lit statue of Lucifer sitting outside the State Capitol either, I'm sure, but some people seem to forget about church/state separation when it's *their* church.

The other side is about businesses using the word "Christmas", which is completely fabricated. The only warring is from individuals who scream bloody murder and organize boycotts any time a company tries to be inclusive and says "holiday" or "season" instead of "christmas". I've never heard of a boycott against a company *for* saying "Christmas".

GheeH of OR 4:49PM December 23, 2011

This argument fails to acknowledge the distinction between government expressions of religious belief and private expressions of religious belief. The former has been illegal since the ratification of the constitution, though we've seen periods of both greater and lesser enforcement of that law. I've not noticed any coordinated effort to squelch the latter nor does this post mention one. I'm voting it down because it's simply off-topic and not relevant to the discussion at hand.

Daniel Miles of OR 3:41PM December 23, 2011

For anyone crying about alleged attacks on religious free speech I have two words: Fred Phelps.

Kira of CA 11:14PM December 22, 2011

No one is attacking free speech. The freedom of religion clause mandates that if one group is allowed to display something outside a courthouse/on other public property, then all groups are. No one is attacking the nativity scenes - people are just demonstrating that they have other beliefs.

TC of IN 5:27PM December 22, 2011

Why are some Christians so terrified of government neutrality towards religion? That's all secularism is. Is their faith that weak that they need big government support to back it up, to validate it?

Why are they terrified of fairness? Does it really have to be spelled out for them, that they wouldn't like Islam or Hinduism receiving special treatment? Do they have to be slapped across the face with our government institutions endorsing Ramadan, or Passover? Or, even though atheism isn't a religion, what about the government endorsing blasphemy? The First Amendment, as interpreted, doesn't allow that either.

Fairness and neutrality goes all the way, friends.

Our constitution is neutral when it comes to religion--secular. It was written by very smart, very attentive, very detail-oriented people specifically to be that way. It's the best situation for ALL citizens, as history had taught them.

Please understand that, and stop fighting for special treatment for your own personal beliefs.

Ed of NY 4:31PM December 22, 2011

As a staunch atheist, I'd like to start by wishing everyone a merry Christmas and try to dispel this paranoid fantasy that non-believers are somehow colluding to destroy this great holiday. Unlike the author of this article, I don't paint large, disparate, and loosely-banded groups of people with a broad brush based on the shitty behaviour of one member. Good luck with your persecution complex. Me and the rest of America will keep celebrating this season as a time to help our fellow man, come together, and show gratitude for the good in our lives. People can keep trying to twist reality into an implausible conspiracy by a demonized and largely powerless minority to oppress and persecute a hugely influential and vocal majority that already has a privileged status in society; but please don't expect admiration for doing it.

ElKabong of CA 3:22PM December 22, 2011

"My understanding of the issue at Travis Air Force Base is that this year the tradition of each unit having a sign with their holiday greetings was for the first time changed to include a Nativity"

It's been here for years. It's just this year a atheist/humanist group wanted to put a sign. Which is funny because putting up a sign stating that you don't believe in God is rather humorous to say the least. Also to note; The emblem on the sign is nothing more than mockery and condescending of those who do believe in God. Regardless, it is that very group who claims to be open-minded and mature. Irony at its finest. With that being said; With that emblem their intent is blatantly obvious despite what they'll claim. This is evidenced in the fact that a sign alone wasn't/isn't enough and if they're honest I'm quite sure they would admit it.

Travis Airman of CA 2:47PM December 22, 2011

My understanding of the issue at Travis Air Force Base is that this year the tradition of each unit having a sign with their holiday greetings was for the first time changed to include a Nativity, that the problem with various Nativity displays is that they involve tax monies, and of the issue at the Air Force Academy being that military rules were being broken and Operation Christmas Child, which Academy cadets are still participating in, is now properly back under the sponsorship of the chaplain, where it should have been in the first place. Certainly before a group starts singing in a Post Office, Courthouse, store or anywhere else the minimum of politeness is to ask if it's okay with management.

Christians wouldn't be getting their feelings hurt if they would raise the money for their celebrations themselves instead of trying to fund them out of tax money also collected from secularists, and would follow the established rules and demonstrate ordinary politeness. Seems to me people aren't objecting to religion so much as they are obnoxious entitlement, greed and rudeness, none of which used to be considered tenets of the faith.

crowepps of AK 1:56PM December 22, 2011

1 2 >