The Storm Around France’s First Muslim Cabinet Minister, Rachida Dati
Reader Comments
this is an lowlife outrage
Now you encourage these amish addicts,They could care less about a doctor who is most of the time right.They wear too many clothes ,cutting off thier vitamin d.This has a reaction,now they are vampires to our health department,and a waste of time.Before you say anything juncky,ask yourself this amish question ,could you go without a car,or a bike?Its the same with tobacco,or without a lung.YOU ARE ANTICHRIST,WITHOUT A DOCTOR!
One new item
Miss Dati had a baby and is now criticized for going back to work too fast... Sets a bed example for women in France...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7819657.stm
I wonder what will happen if she changes hair color...
Answer (1)
I was born in Ain Tebouchen, Oran, Algeria.
Keep going...
Police acts independently from the government???? You are a joking, right?
There are no 'black or Arabs school' in France? Wrong, one 'Arab school’ is in the process of being insolvent... (Private schools by the way as are many in the US). France has the particularity of using religion to discriminate… Schools reflect the population surrounding them, in France as in the US. Never mind that....
Prison population as distorted as in France... Not a sign of racial profiling hey? Also not a sign that the government is passively (like in the US) accepting racial profiling. Wasn’t that what I was underlining? Never mind...
Near 'Les halles Paris’ You can purchase anything there from the services of a prostitute to a cheap haircut (Euro 5 for a cut). What is the population make-up in these streets, other than tourists? North African, Middle East and a few blacks. That these areas are simmering with racial anger is not important or real. That the same areas are divided by races is not significant. That the government is well aware of it is... Just never mind right?
Cemeteries segregated by religion, right, one caveat, this is not happening in the US or at a lesser degree. I do not see many ‘targeted vandalism’ of tombs in the US. Segregation in death is the direct influence of the roman church and nothing else, a church that has embraced discrimination of the livings from the get-go but never mind hey?
That a few got rich is not important and not relevant. Yeah, just like this economy where a few a getting rich through barely legal means (as was slave trading at the time) but never mind that, not relevant to 21st century politics.
As to being fair… France (and modern Europe) has had about 15 centuries to learn (and has not) the US barely 2.5 centuries to do the same thing but never mind that. Enslaving entire countries is not important and the push promote a ‘positive side of colonization’ is not of consequence. Funny tho, Algeria was one the colonies…
Aggressive or full of sarcasm? But never mind that… ‘Le Coq Français’ is always above everything else right?
Arrogant? Funny how this word comes when there is very little that can be used to deny what is a dark reality. Start name calling to stop a conversation. Next, I expect to see ‘N’ word, am I correct? Definition of a coq??? Arrogance CQFD
Answer (2)
Fox news aficionado? My information comes from Le Monde, Herald Tribune, BBC, The time, Spiegel, LeMonde.com (a comprehensive news outlets from other countries, world wide) as I am a heavy news reader. I do not even have (oh, I can see the next hilarious comment) a cable connected to our TV, aerial or otherwise.
You are the one completely out of touch. The US is moving forward, albeit slowly, in most racial fronts; France has been stagnant since the mid 70s and is now moving backward in every area. So, yes, the US is ahead of France.
It is significant this quote, from the article: *"If her name was not Dati, she would no longer be a minister," a cabinet colleague says under cover of anonymity.* escaped your ‘fair scrutiny’. We have the same reaction in the US… ‘If this guy was not black he would be in this position or would have been fired’…
- Government is not behind the police raids to snatch (illegal) immigrant kids (black and Arabs)? You must be joking. Last time I checked illegal immigrant children get an education in the US w/o fear of being arrested by a bunch of gorillas in riot gear during recess…
- Government has not been making mandatory the racial profiling of pupils? You ARE joking. Attacking the weaker point of immigrants (children), using the school registration is not a government action but that of a few weirdoes, right?
- Schools are not segregated due to their neighborhood make-up in France like in the US? Your jokes are starting to become boring.
If one example could have been used, it was South Africa but then again, it seems that this country is moving backward now. This is quite natural thought, we cannot ask everyone to be saints or evils.
Unless you used ethnicity as a euphemism for race, check what that word means. Either way, that show real regression in France if elected officials are trying to create ANOTHER profiling system.
As a final insult… You wanted balance, you have balance. France IS not and WAS never in the fore front of racial equality
PS. I am waiting for the next qualification… Both citizenship and born in Algeria what is next?
Note I also love the from NY, IL then NE... Shows real integrity. If you fear being tracked... YOU ARE! man...
So Sad for you
You still very fuzzy too me, always very suspicious about people believing they know "the truth".
The funny part is that my parents are from North Africa and my generation are way better than them, yes there is racism in France, you don't understand my point. Again, I am talking about "tracking" people from a "race" perspective. That's just does not exist in France.
You are using "cliches" to analyze the situation, a one event per million...
Here the list of your arguments, that I agree are not positive for France but are not an official position, nor events seen everywhere:
1- "ask them about the kids being removed from school by the police; It happens a few times in all history of the thousand of schools, so representative of the French system...
2- " ask them about their problems when in a school located in one of the segregated area… I tend to agree with this point but my point is that there is no "black" or "arab" schools, like you can have here in the US, schools with ethnic majority...
3- "Check the prison population racial make-up…" Oh Yeah in the US it is much better
4- "Segregated neighborhoods examples? Check the area near ‘Les Halles de Paris’ (no need to travel to Marseille or Lyon to see it)" You are so funny I lived from 2002 to 2005, and yes it is a very diversed area and I still visit every year with friends over there. Another cliche...
5- "segregated cemeteries as we find them in France", well a cemetery is segregated by religion not ethnicity or race if you want to use this concept, sorry wrong again...
I don't say like you do, that one country is ahead, both have to learn from each other. History check: 40 yrs in the US, black and white did not share the same schools or restroom, you are right, so the US is so in advance.
When you compare the "slave owner" in the US, just think about the fact that the US country side (mostly South) was full of farmers like that, you cannot compare those guys to the few rich French families that profiting from the slave trade, this 2 racist population just does not match in numbers.
You are as much fair as Fox News...
I can tell by the agressivity of your tone that your arguments are not relevant, that's debate 101. You are just a bitter person, with an arrogant side on that subject.
Yeah, Right (2)
In more ways than one the US, not France is a step ahead when it comes to racism and integration. It takes two generations in the US for an immigrant family to progress upward (One, if you look at our president elect, who happens to be black). In France? Promises, promises and no delivery, as long as you are not lily white; you are not really French, even if your forefathers died in the numerous murderous eastern battlefields between Europeans.
It is funny that the racism against blacks in the US originated from the slave trade but is not part of the 21st century politics. Segregation has everything to do with that in the US, France does not have this ‘excuse’.
Yeah, you are right, I am fuzzy, showing blatant one sided point of view and do not know what I am talking about. The ugly slave owner American cannot compete with the varnished salons of the French prosperous criminal merchants of human flesh.
Citizenship? I am supposed to be impressed? Sorry, I have both too. Bring out your age now, that I have a hearty laugh!
It seems to me that you have never left France.
Yeah, right
Lived in Detroit, Michigan; Omaha, Nebraska; Monterey. California; Washington DC area twice, so yeah, I cannot compare, I have no experience. (Oh, for info, before you say I have a limited perspective of only two countries, I also lived in France, Spain, Italy, Bahrain and Japan; I saw racism there too and segregation)…
Reality is far from your bucolic, idealistic, simplistic view of France, type whatever, whenever, it does not change that racism is alive and well in France and is prevalent all over, despite the 'intellectuals' who claim the contrary.
If it was not so, why would the screening of a film in a segregated city bringing together communities or Arabs, black, Jews and French together be celebrated as a 'positive step’?
Please do check a bit before making France a leader of anti racism and an example.
'Fuzzy information'? Check again the blatant example of policies being applied in the school... Ask any teacher or school administrator what they think about that one; ask them about the kids being removed from school by the police; ask them about their problems when in a school located in one of the segregated area… Check the prison population racial make-up…
Segregated neighborhoods examples? Check the area near ‘Les Halles de Paris’ (no need to travel to Marseille or Lyon to see it); check Porte de Clichy; check Vitreuil and all the ‘cites dortoirs’. How about the gypsies’ segregation in polluted campground? Where do you think the past years urban unrest is coming from? Oh, yeah, 'la racaille des banlieues' to quote the current president of France, then ‘ministre de l'interieur’...
How about segregated cemeteries as we find them in France? Ever heard of vandalism done there? (The last one a few days ago)
Segregation has several sources; this is another topic, but institutionalization of it by society, religious beliefs and self interest has been alive for millenniums (and documented all over Europe. Where do you think the ‘quartiers juifs’ came from? The red guy? You still believe in that trespasser?
When you go back to France (or anywhere else for that matter) please make sure you use pink tainted glasses so that everything looks colored, plug in your MP3 so that you do not hear anything other than your own selection (Arabic, Jewish music, among others may hurt your preconceptions), make sure you catch a cold so that you do not smell the spices when passing through segregated areas.
In more ways than one the US, not France is a step ahead when it comes to racism and integration. It takes two generations in the US for an immigrant family to progress upward (One, if you look at our president elect). In France? Promises, promises and no delivery, as long as you are not lily white; you are not really French, even if your forefathers died in the numerous murderous eastern battlefields between Europeans.
To "Actually"
Well, I confirm again "race" is not "tracked" in France. Your statement is not true and you can tell by your foggy explanation.
Some people actually are actually lobbying to track ethnicity (not "race") to assess "discrimination" and "racial profiling", which I agree, exist in France and need to be fought.
In the US, we have "Caucasian" on driver license, no such concept in France.
To your comment "France is not better than the US and the US is not better than France", if you read again I wrote both countries have best practices. I just overweighed my criticism toward the US to balance the fact that the original article was to bias toward the US. So yes, I agree with you "Vive la difference".
About your statement "Segregated neighborhoods exist in all major towns and all secondary towns in France." It is so cliche. Did you travel accross the US? (not travel in France as you misunderstood) Well you will see what I am refering to: 95% of a community, a neighborood based on "race" in the major US cities not like in France where you start to have small segretated portion of a part of a city itself. I know it is difficult to explain but bottom is line: in France you may have segregation of some portion of a neighborood per se but in the US you have neighboroods differenciating themselves racially to the adjacent neighboroods..
Slavery is another topic, no direct link with our subject that deals with 21st Century politics.
About your background, well, I am sorry, but I have both citizenships, lived several years in both and now travel back and forth between the 2 so you don't have the monopoly of having a fair perspective.
