Activists Work to Show Gays Are Not Anti-Religious

Try biblical literacy...

because that is what you are lacking. During ancient times, hospitality was very important to at least the Middle Eastern cultures and more important than family honor. While this is unacceptable and wicked to us today, the ancient peoples of Lot's time were okay with it. It should be noted that God did not approve of these things and still does not approve of them. Being righteous does not mean perfection. Noah was righteous, but he got drunk and God does not like drunkeness. Abraham was righteous, but he didn't trust God to protect him despite what God was doing and going to do for him.

God didn't choose Lot to be righteous. Lot was righteous because of his faith in God, even though it was weak.

Lot's wife was turned into salt because she looked back. Again, nothing that suggests sex. Your sources must be lacking in considering context because your arguments take selected verses out without considering those around them.

Wine was typically safer to drink than water. Does that excuse the actions of the daughters? No, but it does make sense for Lot to take wine along.

I don't need to have a degree in all of those "sciences" because nothing you are saying is scientific. You are making things up because a certain phrase gets you excited, when there is nothing to get excited about. Do you have a problem? Because you put sex into things where it clearly isn't there.

No, some Christians are old earth Creationists and believe God created the earth billions of years ago and eventually went on with the days of Creation. Others are youn earth Creationists and to them the world is only 6000 to 9000. Then there are theistic evolutionists who say God created life through evolution. In the end, it doesn't matter which is true because none of them are salvation issues for Christians. The Bible only indicates that life was not done by evolution, not what the age of the world is.

The writers of the Bible were not too concerned with how certain materials like tar were brought about. They were more interested in God's interaction with humanity. Also, who's to say that God couldn't have created the earth with fossil fuels and materials already? If He could create the universe by thought and spoken word alone, then this too would be possible for Him.

Another insulting comment improperly using my name

Drf once again shows flawed etiquette in using my first name, as if knows me. We must all use the "name" posted by commentators, to identify them, but it's rude to make his comments as if I'm the only person reading his jeremiads. He misreads the Lot incest tale & forgets Lot offered his virgin daughters to a mob for gang rape, before God "chose Lot as a righteous man," & sent him off with his wife & daughters. It is a typical dirty traveling salesman's joke. Get rid of the protective mom by "turning her to salt," *drying her out sexually," and leaving dad with the girls, after he made them take plenty of wine along to excuse the dirty deed. Drf has a tremendous gap in his reading of psychology, mythology, pathology and other sciences that can be used to analyze what Scripture writers had in mind. Creationists say Earth isn't as old as 9000 years. It took millions of years for buried fern forests of the dinosaur age to turn into petroleum. Yet the Ark was said to be caulked with tar. Bible authors were ignorant people as shown by their contradictions. Eagerness to believe their product depends on intellectual level of people of any era.

aura, stop lying...

it isn't becoming of you. Look, in Genesis 19:30-38 we find that the daughters and Lot were hiding in a cave in some nearby mountains. They notice there was no man among them. This doesn't mean they thought they were the last three people on earth. Notice, they didn't talk to God about their problem nor do we see God pointing to Lot as the solution to their problem. Also, the women were more interested in preserving their family line (verse 32) than the whole human race. The daughters are responsible for their actions. They acted out their sinful thoughts. Lot, though rather drunk and was not aware of what was happening, did have some responsibility in marrying off his daughters which he failed to do. But to say it was all Lot's fault is deceiving. Not all sin is sex related, see Acts 5:1-11.

Not all church leaders or members are sex crazy.

You and others might be millionares, but money and wealth do not provide joy or peace. Money can be inflated into being worthless. Material posessions can be destroyed or stolen. But the gift of God is eternal. Repentance does not mean you are proud of your sins. Anyone who comes before God with pride and asks for forgiveness does not understand what he is doing. It is a confession made through humility and humbleness because you are not coming before a spiritual machine that gives eternal life when you say the "magic words". You are coming before a holy God who doesn't have to do anything for you.

If you study the Torcaso v. Watkins case in 1961, you'll find that Secular Humanism is considered a religion by the Supreme Court.

You see the same things done by atheistic groups who sell merchandise to kids and adults, yet you don't consider them false. Actually, the age of fossils is rather misleading. Consider strata fossils, fossils that are in multiple layers of rock at once. If it takes hundreds of years for rock layers to form, then the organic material for the fossil to be made would have decomposed well before the fossilization process. Also, the fossil record doesn't support macro-evolution. If we were concerned about students, then we should give all of the evidence for both sides and not just support one side. After all, we want them to make well informed decisions don't we?

I believe you are alluding to Psalm 14:1. Yes, the English word is fool, but the Hebrew word for fool is also rendered as someone who is sinful or unrighteous. Hell is not a torture chamber. It is a place of punishment for those who chose not to be saved. God hates sin and His nature demands that He punish those who are sinful. He loves us, so He made a way for us not to have to face judgment. But He also gave us free will to choose His salvation or not. Those who don't are have no one to blame but themselves. You are stuck in the Middle Ages. We had a Reformation and many are living with it. Get with the program.

Bible exlains why Christians believe..ah, yes.....

Pat says the Bible explains why Christians believe in God. It does say people are FOOLS if they don't believe. 1. Don't want to be called a FOOL by ignorant men who lived before the first scientists appeared. Bible says Hellfire is for disbelievers. 2. Don't want to TORTURED in Hell for the sin of disbelief. Bible says a life of LUXURY awaits in Heaven, but only for believers. 3. Don't want to miss out on that. Bible says God adopts believers to be HEIRS to his endless assets. 4. Oboy. Count me in--I'm tired of working to support a family after God cursed parenthood in Eden and threw them out for having sex. Bible tells preachers to tell believers that for every dollar they tithe, they get it back "multiplied TEN times, packed down and running over." 5. Well, who would be a fool & not put more money in the next pledge envelope?" Want proof God does not exist? Add up money reasons listed here & add threat of excommunication. That means HELLFIRE -it prevents believers from confessing & being forgiven by a preacher. The US was formed by ending here the Old World system where priests ran kingdoms by telling monarchs what to do--or be sent to Hell.

Pat says Dustin doesn't read or understand Bible, but..

In the USA, civil government makes us responsible. Killers aren't executed because they're "guilty of committing the sin of murder," but because they're "guilty of committing the crime of murder." Pat doesn't seem to know the definition of

the word "secular." It's the opposite of being based on religion. Humanism means being based on humans as a species, not as subjects of mythic non-human gods. Secular humanism never was & never will be a religion. Pat wants to harm children by by making them "study Creationism" in public schools. That means spending millions of dollars in taxes to pay authors & publishers of fiction that tells lies to chlldren, making them believe the world is less than 6000 years old. Recently, an Ardi skull was discovered in Ethiopia, 4.4 MILLION years old. Other pre-humans lived over 7 million years ago. Creationism is a form of mental child abuse--to cripple thinking ability as surely as arms can be crippled by twisting them out of shape. Follow the money to sellers of Creationist merchandise, literature, museums tickets, etc and there we have the motive for Creationist raids on public treasuries.

Sept. Dryf said God had zero to do with Lots Dtrs. but

God killed everything in 2 cities, saving Lot because he was "righteous." God made the girls believe Daddy was "the Last Man on Earth." That, by the way, is a theme used in traveling=salesman joke porn. The naive girls bought the scam that God kept the 3 alive to preserve the human species. Bible writers salaciously had Lot's family tote along enough booze to give Lot the alibi of "being too drunk to know he was having the extreme of male pleasure"--orgasms. So DryF is deceptive when he blames the females. Don't bother to be embarrassed over white=washing dear old God in this bit of incest porn. I imagine it's lingered over by incest-seeking step-fathers & some men who adopt baby girls who come from non-aborted conceptions. In many pages of Scripture, where believers "see sin," I recognize sentence structure & content that fit definitions of porn. Dryf can't grasp the fact that not everyone is so egotistical as to wish being "singled our as special by a god." Many of us are millionaires who don't need to "adopted by a king to inherit his riches." No atheist is so lacking in self-respect as to want to grovel down an aisle and claim to be the proud proprietor of vast amounts of sins."

Yes Dustin, but...

God also made people responsible for their actions. Reading the Bible explains why Christians believe what they believe, so trying to discredit Christian beliefs about God without really reading and understanding it makes no sense. Secular humanism is a religion, but its proponents deny that so they can continue to influence children in the classroom without offering the students other choices. The government using Christianity as a controlling device? Uh-huh...

Give some proof as to why God doesn't exist.

Try NOT reading the Bible.

Seperation of Church and State. If God was real...he would say "I gave humans the freedom of choice to do whatever they want" OH WAIT! He did say that. Too bad he isn't real maybe the "Christians would listen more closely if he was... I would love nothing more than sit and disprove Christianity and talk about how the government promotes Christianity only as a control device, but this is about gay marriage. Wait...I guess it has allot to do with it.

Try reading the Bible...

Biblical marriage is the union of one man and one wife. This union is the only place for sex. Marriage wasn't created for sex, but sex for marriage. As I have said earlier, Naomi and Ruth were not gay. Nothing suggests that unless you twist Scripture. As I have said on another article, the fact that Jesus descended from Moab shows that God is willing to use Gentiles and the unrighteous to further His plan for redemption. Remember, Jesus was sinless. The blame is with Lot and his daughters, not God. God allowed them to do it, but He did not make them do it. They are responsible for their own actions. Actually, divorce proves nothing except the separation of what was once united. Not all marriages are performed by religious leaders, also what preachers get for performing the ceremony it typically a gift and not a fee. Again, money does not prove or disprove the validity of Christianity. I have read Leviticus, but I have also read Romans which says all sinners are condemned to death and not just gays. Thank God that He has forgiven us through the sacrificial death of His Son Jesus! Now that we have been forgiven, is it right to continue to do what originally condemned us? If you had actually read my last post, you'd see the purpose behind clean and unclean animals. You can not come before God, the King and Creator of the universe, with whatever you want. The Lord determined that only certain animals were worthy to be offered as sacrifices, thus they were considered holy. The priests didn't eat all of the sacrifices, just certain ones. And then they could only eat what they could pull of the altar with a certain fork. Whatever came off, they got no matter its size. There are certain parts to be sacrificed, hooves and such are not it. Give an example of a preacher who says gays should be killed, and I'll show you a man who doesn't understand the Scriptures.

aura, next time research what you post before you write it. It's very embaressing to debate with someone who has no idea what they are saying.

More for Dryfire and "Religion began for profit."

I repeat that Scripture writers invented religion to create a class of paid preachers..for money, for assets of all kinds. Thanks to Dryfire for reminding us the concept of "Clean Animals" began with the Ark tale. Why must they be "clean?" So they, having value like any foodstuff, could be sacrificed to God. Priests are "agents of God on Earth" so all sacrifices go through their hands. Most parts of sacrificed animals go to priests, after they burn a few bits of hairy skin or hooves. Then they feast on roast lamb, tasty chickens, etc. The profiteering motive behind Scripture was so vital that it had to be carried forward after the Flood. Gays and Lesbians, I ask you to read Leviticus very carefully. Ask yourselves why you pay preachers who tell congregations you deserve to be killed, which also means you will be tortured forever in Hell? In 2009, why cling to curses that are so like voodoo practiced by medicine men in tribal Africa before the Age of Enlightenment? I say Nature gives us homosexuals as a benefit. I think some women, not all, give us homosexuals because there are changes in timing and volume of nutrients flowing to the fetus.